Michelle Gomez Talks ‘Chilling Adventures of Sabrina’ and ‘Doctor Who’ at Denver Pop Culture Con

Chilling Adventures of Sabrina released its second offering in April after debuting in October of last year. One of the characters is Madam Satan (also known as Mary Wardwell, also known as Lilith) who guides Sabrina into the hands of The Dark Lord. 

Madam Satan is played by Michelle Gomez, and while Madam Satan has a decidedly dedicated fanbase it isn’t her first experience as such. She also appeared opposite Peter Capaldi during his run as The Doctor’s former best friend. 

She attended Denver Pop Culture Con, where she discussed some memories of her favorite series, how she ended up doing an American accent, any potential for Missy to return to Doctor Who, and more during her spotlight panel. 

Here are some highlights from the panel, edited and condensed for clarity. You can always watch the full video.

 On Comedy Being Her Niche (Maybe)

One of the first times that Gomez appeared on screen was in a British series called The Book Group. Gomez reflected on how she got cast in the series and how it changed the trajectory of her career.

“Actually, it was a surprise to me, and it still is, that I’m funny,” Gomez said. “I don’t come at things trying to be funny. I started as a very serious classical actress, which lasted for about five minutes. And then Annie Griffin who was the creator, writer, and director of The Book Group saw me in a very dramatic production at the Edinburgh Festival in Scotland.”

“I was playing a very serious ghost, called Agnes, up at the back behind the piano, and she took me for lunch and said that was one of the funniest performances she’s ever seen in her life. I was like ‘It was Ibsen.’ And I was a bit, sort of shocked, and she said, ‘I’ve got a part for you, called Janice, in a thing called The Book Group, if you want to talk about it.”

“It really was, in its day, kind of groundbreaking and weird and different. Annie is American so I think she was ahead of her time really, and it kind of blew up in Scotland and then continued to have national success around Britain,” she added.

While Gomez might have found a niche in playing characters with a humorous bent after playing Janice, there was a period after The Book Group when she wasn’t getting much work. 

“After The Book Group, there was another long drought of all sorts of nonsense, basically, say yes to anything, because I wasn’t getting much work. But that’s kind of how I learn, it’s sort of what carved me, shaped me, and made me who I am today, so it was a journey I had to go on,” Gomez said.

“I can see in hindsight, I can see that that’s what it was, but at the time it was like, ‘Oh man, I’m gonna give up. I’m gonna be a gardener.’ Which I’ve tried, but normally I kill plants, just looking at them,'” she joked.

On Green Wing

Gomez also played Staff Liaison Officer Sue White on Green Wing. 

“If you were a staff liaison officer in the Basingstoke Hospital, being totally and utterly bored shitless by people’s problems, you’d probably start to get a little bit creative.”

“That’s kind of why I started to try and develop into that character’s reading. It wasn’t just bonkers for bonkers-sake. She wasn’t just being crazy and wearing long arms for no good reason. It was heartening for a reason,” Gomez said.

“Probably because, in that role, or in any kind of public service role, it’s hard to get your voice heard. So it’s probably the frustrations and inertia that would come along with that. Hence, long arms, or riding a camel down a hospital corridor.” 

Green Wing was filmed in a working hospital. Gomez has some funny memories of filming the show and being mistaken for a member of the staff.

“I would have so many people running up to me asking where ER was, or where the ear, nose, and throat was. Like I knew! And at first, I would try to explain that, ‘No, I’m just an actor,’ and then actually at the end, I’d be like, ‘Yea, it’s just two corridors down there on the right,’ and ‘I’ll be with you in a moment.'”

She also has one frightening memory of filming the show. 

“I was in the way,” Gomez laughed. “As often is the case, but they literally like shoved me out of frame, but I went tumbling back into surgery, and just stood there like that [thinking] ‘Can they see me? Because I can see them. And that guy’s appendix.'”

On Finding Madam Satan’s Accent

Moderator Ken Reid asked Gomez about Madam Satan’s accent. While there are ch

“Up until very recently, I only ever did one accent, and that was Scottish, and then [Chilling Adventures of Sabrina] was like, ‘You’re American,’ and I was like, ‘Hmm, am I?'” she remembered.

While Madam Satan was written to be American, Gomez recalled her callback for the role when she had devised another plan for the character entirely.

“It was in the test, in the screen test, and I’d already jumped through all these hoops, but I was like, I’m going to play Mary Wardwell in a Scottish accent, and when I turn into Madam Satan, I’ll just get all, Maggie Smiths on your ass, right,” Gomez said.

“So that’s what I did, in the test, and then they went ‘Okay, could you do like a practice test in the morning.’ So you get to kind of work with the director and the producer, and if they really like and you’re their number one–you don’t know that on the day–but they try to give you the best possible chance.”

“So there was a voice up in the back of the room, and it was dark, it was a bit like this,” said Gomez gesturing the audience. “She said, ‘Okay, that’s great, can you do it again in American?’ And I was like, ‘No cos the thing is I think I should be very Scottish and then be like very English.’ ‘Yea American.’ ‘Okay can you just like.’ ‘American. It’s too confusing otherwise.’ And I was like, ‘For who?'”

The voice asked to see the screen test in an American accent again.

“On the day, I went and I stood in the corner I was like ‘Aww man.’ I’d never done an American accent before! I was like, ‘Oh god, okay,’ and I was like ‘God if you’re there, if there is one, if you exist. Anything. He, she, it, whatever. Help me now.'”

“And this voice came to me, and it was Barbara,” exclaimed Gomez. “Barbara! Barbara just appeared. And ‘I was like ‘Oh Barbara! Help me, Barbara.’ A spirit medium, I swear to god, Barbara from the QVC Channel! She’d just been fired. So I was like, ‘Come with me, Barbara.’ And I went into the room, and Barbara came with me, and Madam Satan was born!”

On Fandom

Chilling Adventures of Sabrina is the second time that Gomez has been a part of a show with a passionate fandom. (The first being Doctor Who, where she played Missy.) Reid asked her about her perception of the convention circuit and interacting with fans. 

“It’s mindblowing, it really fills me up. I hear some people saying that these things are really tiring. You know, they’re full days, and it’s a lot of energy, but I leave just so filled up and blown away that I’ve got more than two fans. It’s not my mom and my dog,” Gomez shared. 

On a Possible Return to Doctor Who

The floor then opened to questions, the first being about any chance Missy might return. She was last seen in Doctor Who Season 10 Episode 12, “The Doctor Falls,” supposedly dying on a forest floor after being shot in the back by her previous self with a laser screwdriver. 

“There’s such an amazing dynamic between Peter and I. So when Peter left I was like ‘I can’t imagine being The Master to any other Doctor,'” she said. “But I do feel, having said that, now that I’ve gone — I feel like I’ve got a Christmas Special in me. I feel like I might need to bitchslap Jodie there for a moment.”

On the First Time She Saw Herself as Missy

The next fan asked Gomez about the moment when she first saw the finished product of Missy on Doctor Who with all the effects. 

“There’s a thing called ADR–don’t ask me what that stands for–but, it’s basically a bost syncing that happens after each episode before they lock it down and they have the sound that locks to the image,” Gomez said. 

“Sometimes you need to re-record something, you need to refresh something, you need to attend to some sound difficulties, whatever,  that’s when you get to first see it. So I was in a dark sound booth, on my own, with the sound engineer, going, ‘Oh my god! Look at me!  I’m in Doctor Who!'”

On Any Mementos She Might Have Kept From Set

Reid asked Gomez if she kept any mementos from her projects. Gomez said that she keeps something from everything including the last season of Chilling Adventures of Sabrina. 

“From the last season of Sabrina, I wore these Jimmy Choo shoes, they were like four-inch heel black patent Jimmy Choos. I’m still shopping at Top Shop. I’m still at H&M. So that was like the first pair of designer shoes I’ve ever had on my feet, and I kept them!”  

“Because I wore them every single day,” she exclaimed after a murmur of laughter. “I was like, they’re mine. I own them. I earned them.”

On Working With John Simm

Gomez’s final episodes of Doctor Who brought back a previous incarnation of The Master, played by John Simm. Gomez recalled one moment when she had some fun during one of Simms’ close-ups. 

“You do scenes over and over and over again, right. You do the wide. Then you come in, you do the close-up and then you turn around. It’s just a lot for one scene,” Gomez said.

“By the end of it, you start–I like to have fun. Pissing about with focus is basically the professional term, and I had to, in the scene, pull something out of my décolletage–that’s boobs.”

“Anyway, I said to the props guy, ‘Do you have a pear?'” Gomez recalled. “And I popped the pear, down my pair, and it was his close-up so the camera can’t see what I’m doing, right. So you say the line, and we’re very, very close, and I pulled the [pear] from my décolletage and I said, ‘I have a lovely pear,’ and he just lost it.”

“And that’s on camera somewhere. We’ve got that,” she continued. “That’s a behind the scenes.”

On Paranormal Experiences on the Sabrina Set

Chilling Adventures of Sabrina has more pagan and occult energy to it than any of its predecessors. One fan asked if there had been any paranormal or supernatural experiences that have occurred on the set.

Gomez described an experience she had moving between sound stages one night. 

“There is something with the show, for sure, and we can kind of feel it,” Gomez said.

“First of all, our phenomenal production designer, her name is Lisa Soper, she’s heavily into the occult, and she does take it quite seriously. And the sets that she’s built and created for us is very unusual, it works on a 360-degree axis. So wherever you point the camera, you’re always in the world,” she explained.

“It means that you forget that you’re on a set, and we have two stages, sound stages. They’re huge because obviously it’s a big show and it has to incorporate a lot. But sometimes, you’re running from stage one to stage two depending on what episode you’re on,” explained Gomez

“And at night, it’s like, we shoot through the night. It’s like 3 o’clock in the morning and I’ve got my Jimmy Choos on, and you’re always with somebody. William is normally my guy. He always runs with me,” she continued.

“But I hate walking. Like it bores the shit out of me. So I always run. Or I’m driven. So I’ll run from set to set. So I’ve left William behind, and I get onto the set of the school and it’s a corridor in Sabrina. I swear to god, I can’t do it on my own anymore. There is something in there that’s so alive. There’s just an energy. I don’t know what it is.” said Gomez.

Memorable Lines from Missy

During her time as Missy on Doctor Who, Michelle Gomez got to say several memorable lines. One fan asked her about her favorite lines from her run. 

“She did get some good lines. My favorite still, ‘Tell him the bitch is back,'” said Gomez. “I was like ‘Oh my god! Can I really say that? It’s a kid’s show!’ ‘You’re my secret favorite,’ as I stroked some Dalek’s bumps, inappropriately,'” said Gomez.

She also talked a bit about the first time she saw Peter Capaldi as The Doctor on set. 

“The first time I ever saw Peter–he didn’t notice, because I was behind him, and I’m creepy,” joked Gomez. “I walked in and he was rehearsing the next scene or going through the lines of the next scene, and he was standing in the Tardis–which is obviously bigger on the inside.”

“And it caught my breath, it took my breath away, just seeing him, The Doctor, in the Tardis, and the whole buppity, boop, boop thing, and the two layers which is a duplex. I didn’t realize there was a duplex going on there as well, which is a nice resale detail,” Gomez remembered.

On Her Favorite Cereal and Scottish Food She Misses

A fan asked Gomez what her favorite breakfast cereal is.

“Oh, I do love a cereal,” Gomez said. “It’s gonna be a mix because I’m like that. So I’d like to say, nice little rice puff blah, blah blah, but I love Cheerios with banana, muesli, yogurt, fruit, cacao–I don’t do cacao. I just wanted to say cacao!” 

Reid then followed up asking Gomez if there were any Scottish foods she missed.

“Jesus Christ. Yes! Scottish food is the best food!” she exclaimed. “Are you kidding me. If you’ve got it, deep fry it! Deep fry anything!”

But Gomez has ways of getting a taste of home every now and again. 

“There are certain things that I have a mule, in the shape of my nephew Craig bring over. Tonics tea cakes, which is a sort of marshmallow situation covered in chocolate with a biscuit base. Anything chocolate-y, wafer-y, anything chocolate really. Pickled Onion Monster Munch, but that’s not just Scottish, but we won’t say it is, because they just make your eyes water and you can taste the chemicals,” Gomez elaborated. 

“And Irn-Bru, of course,” Gomez added. “Get out the Irn-Bru. It’s very good for you. It’s really, really good for you if you’re not feeling well, and if you are feeling well, as well.”

On Mary Wardwell’s Rib

Another audience question was about Mary Wardwell’s rib, which Madam Satan ripped out during Chilling Adventures of Sabrina Season 1 Episode 18, “Chapter Eighteen: The Miracles of Sabrina Spellman.”

Given that Mary Wardwell returned on Chilling Adventures of Sabrina Season 1 Episode 20, “The Mephisto Waltz,” there is some concern over exactly what is going to happen to the space where her rib was supposed to be. 

“That’s a good point because I ripped that out, didn’t I? God, that’s gotta hurt,” Gomez said. “Well, we’re gonna find out.”

“You nearly got me!” Gomez teased. “You nearly got me. I’m not the brightest, and there was almost a spoiler there.” 

On Any Research She May Have Done as Lilith

Another fan asked her if she did any research regarding the occult or if she looked in the mythology of Lilith at all. 

“A lot of the storylines and how our characters develop, happen as we’re filming. So we’re given only just enough information to have a clue as to why we’re saying what we’re saying. But, we don’t have full character developmental arcs until further into the series. And that’s because it was a first series, so everyone’s still trying to find out who they are and why they’re there.”

“The Lilith detail didn’t come to me until further into the shooting of it and I don’t really like scary stuff. Didn’t really do the whole Ouija board thing. Basically just watched Seinfeld. Because the show is like a cross between Rosemary’s Baby and The Exorcist with fabulous clothes,” explained Gomez.

Now, Gomez is coming around to the idea of horror. 

“I have come round to the whole notion of horror now. I’d sort of made up my mind about it when I got scared shitless one year when I was ten watching Doctor Who when the Zygones were coming,” she added.

“But since doing Sabrina, my research has been watching some of the classic horror movies that have been in our history, and coming to find out, that in horror you can paint with this incredible myriad of colors that you don’t normally get to do in mainstream cinema, it can just get a bit kinda prosaic and formulaic. Whereas in horror, you have the license to tell your story uninhibited, so I’m kind of into horror now.” 

On Missy’s Death

The question of Missy’s death continues to hang in the air even two years after “The Doctor Falls” aired. The beauty of The Master that no matter the situation, the character always pops up with a simple explanation of “I survived.” 

Another fan asked a variation of the question about Missy’s end, specifically wondering if Gomez was surprised by it. 

“It was shocking at the end. I thought bringing John Simm back, and the two of us playing the half of each other was wonderful and weird; to fall in love with one’s self,” Gomez said.

“I thought it was a really clever way to end it, but also, it does feel like the door is still kind of open,” she shared. “With Doctor Who, you just never know. I really don’t feel like she’s dead-dead. I think she’s just busy doing another show.” 

On the Transition from Film to Audio with Missy

Her Doctor Who character has garnered a huge following, so much so that Big Finish Audio Productions has started producing a series of audio dramas centered around her character. A fan, asked about what the transition was like taking Missy from the screen to the sound booth. 

“It’s just me in Vancouver, in a sound booth, with the guys in London, and the sound engineer in London has no idea what is going on because we are just mucking around and there’s a wonderful girl who reads all the other characters, her name is Beth. She’s really, really talented.”

“So the transition is, kind of easy in a way, I don’t know. It’s just different. I’m back with my old gang, I’m back in my old crew. And it’s lovely because I’m in Vancouver, but I’m with my friends in London. Separated by a large body of water. And a lot of land. But that doesn’t matter,” she said.

“Honestly, it took me a long time to get any kind of success, so I’m enjoying every minute of it,” Gomez continued. “Five minutes, I’ve got three minutes left of fame.” 

On the Success of Chilling Adventures of Sabrina

Gomez has had a very long career. Reid asked her how she was enjoying the success of the two shows she’d been a part of. 

“I’m lucky that I’ve had a few good shows that I’ve been part of,” said Gomez.

“At the moment it feels wonderful because there is the anxiety and the excitement and the tension of releasing something new into the world, and you felt that build up with Sabrina,” explained Gomez.

“We filmed, it’s a huge show that we’re filming for ten months, so that’s a lot of work to then hand over to the public and you don’t know if they’re going to like it or not. And there’s a moment where you’re kind of like, ‘Don’t want to give it over.’ We did, and it blew up, and it’s a great success, so at the moment we’re kind of bathing in that glow. But there’s no one moment when you’re you’re like, ‘I’ve made it.'”

Characters Who Inspired Madam Satan

One of the last questions came from a fan who asked Michelle about any other media character that inspired her portrayal of Madam Satan. 

“I try to stay as blank as possible, which is another way of saying I’m really lazy, but it’s also another way of me saying, I just don’t to get intimidated or somehow tainted by anything that might overwhelm me, or make me nervous,” Gomez said.

“For me, it’s all about what’s on the page, all the clues are there,” she added. “And everything that’s on the page and in between the lines, right. That’s where I get my information. And then I have the incredible Angus Strathie put these ridiculously beautiful costumes on me and I’m away to the party. You know, I sort of immerse myself in that.”

Gomez also notes that a lot of her performance is not about what she’s doing on stage, but what her fellow actors are also doing. 

“Also, it’s not just what I’m saying,” Gomez said. “Most of the time, whatever I’m doing on camera isn’t what I’m doing, it’s what I’m reacting to, what I’m getting on the other side of the camera, and that’s always something magnificent. Given the cast I get to work with from Kiernan Shipka to Miranda Otto to Lucy Davis to Richard Coyle. All the wonderful people I get to work with. I’m just bouncing off what they’re doing. I’m really doing bugger all.” 

On Lilith’s Version of Hell in Part III

The last question of the panel came from a fan who wanted to know what Lilith’s version of hell would look like in Part III, now that Lilith has promoted herself to Queen of Hell. 

“You nearly got me, with a spoiler!” Gomez teased.

“How would I know?” she added. “Are we gonna see hell in Season 3? I really don’t know. (I do.)” 

—

Chilling Adventures of Sabrina will return for Part III this year on Netflix.

Doctor Who is available to stream on Amazon Prime. 

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